Talk: Timeline:Pre-crash

Order

Sorry to be a pain, but would this be better if organised chronologically, or similarly to the timeline page for time after the crash? Russell 14:45, 12 April 2006 (PDT)

Merge with Event Chronology? Both pages have very similar content.Russell 05:24, 14 April 2006 (PDT)

Juliet's arrival

I think we're getting ahead of ourselves with the Sept. 11, 2001 date for Juliet's arrival. Based on the Island Chronology, the day in this episode (day 73) is Dec. 3, 2004. By my math, she left on Sept. 5, 2001.

The producers just said it was a significant day. Maybe they really like three day weekends, and enjoy labor day more than most? -BearDog 15:07, 21 February 2007 (PST)

I agree with Juliet's arrival date of Sept. 5, 2001. However, there are some related inconsistencies within the episode "One of Us". In that episode, Juliet is in bed with Goodwin one day before the 3 year anniversary of her arrival. That would make the date, Sept. 4, 2004. She then receives Ben's x-rays and goes to his house to show them to him. The inconsistency is with information presented in "The Cost of Living". Within THAT episode Ben claims that two days after he learned he had a spinal tumor, a spinal surgeon fell out of the sky. So if we use the information from "One of Us" and "The Cost of Living" the crash is on Sept 6. 2004 which we all know is impossible. Can anyone clear this up for me? Or should I add this as a continuity error? If I've misunderstood or overlooked something please let me know. Thanks.--Bigfunkymonkey 00:20, 14 April 2007 (PDT)

Mikhail's Age vs. James Ford's Age

Both are listed in the timeline as having been born in 1969, but that would make Mikhail a little too you to have fought in Afghanistan, wouldn't it? And I have a hard time believing that he is the same age as James Ford. (Of course, I also had a hard time believing that Anthony Cooper and Emily Locke are old enough to be Locke's parents, but...)--sockmonkey 09:48, 9 May 2008 (PDT)

The Soviets were in Afghanistan through 1989, when Mikhail would have been 20. If he enlisted at 18, he could have been in Afghanistan for two to three years. Emily Locke was 15(!) when she conceived Locke, and 16 when she gave birth to him. Cooper is described (by Emily's mom) as "twice" Emily's age, making him about 32 years old in 1954. The problem is only the age of the actors vs. their characters. Mature Emily Locke is played by Swoozie Kurtz, who is four years younger than her character. Cooper is played by Kevin Tighe who is 20 years younger(!) than Anthony Cooper is supposed to be. Meanwhile, John Locke is played by Terry O'Quinn, who is four years older than Locke.--Marksman 07:00, 13 May 2008 (PDT)

David's death

Libby says that David died a month before she met Desmond. Desmond says that he has eight months to prepare for the race when he met Libby. Desmond told Locke that he was in the hatch for three years. That puts David death in 2000/2001 (2004 - 3 years - 9 months) or possibly late 1999. Any further evidence to pin this down? --Mescad 10:47, 25 May 2006 (PDT)

Image:Callsheet.gif shows Desmond and Libby talked about the Elizabeth in 2000. I'm changing the timeline accordingly. ---- LOSTonthis darnisland 09:46, 25 April 2008 (PDT)

Hurley

Bought a Hummer H2 with the money he won, the production for H2 started 2003. --skks 17:45, 23 April 2006 (PDT)

Did production start in 2003 for the 2004 year model, or was it a 2003 year model? In the U.S., the model year for 2003 would have started selling in late 2002.
Jabberwock talk contribs email - 19:44, 23 April 2006 (PDT)

The Hummer H2 went on sale in April 2002. --Pedxing 13:00, 25 April 2006 (PDT)

Wikipedia says the production started in 2003. --skks 12:18, 26 April 2006 (PDT)

I wrote that Wikipedia article! :) Seriously, production started in 2002 with first sales in the second-half of the year[1]. --Pedxing 12:22, 26 April 2006 (PDT)

I'm not disagreeing or even doubting you, I'm just pointing out where I got the info from. --skks 12:24, 26 April 2006 (PDT)

No offense taken. That's model year 2003, not calendar year per Wikipedia standards. --Pedxing 12:32, 26 April 2006 (PDT)

iPods?

I thought sure Hurley was using a CD walkman (round clamshell thing) not an iPod. Anyone? --Pedxing 13:00, 25 April 2006 (PDT)

I think so too. --skks 12:19, 26 April 2006 (PDT)

Definitely a CD walkman. --kaini 12:20, 26 April 2006 (PDT)

Did the writer maybe mean he had one in a flashback? Someone go check the DVDs... --Pedxing 12:22, 26 April 2006 (PDT)

I remember a behind-the-scenes photo where some of the actors are shown listening to iPods. It wouldn't surprise me if an iPod would be used in Lost (because of the co-operation between ABC and Lost (Lost on iTunes) ), but I don't remember any iPods in any episodes... --Jambalaya 04:04, 27 April 2006 (PDT)

Locke

Where did we find out that Locke became paralyzed in 2000? I'm trying to date his backstory. His dad's car (these S-Class Mercs seem carefully selected to me) places the Lockdown flashback after 1991 but of course before he is paralyzed. I'm especially curious to place the kidney operation, since I suspect that was the origin of his paralysis (pure speculation).

Roughly, we have this story, in order:

Anthony Cooper finds him and asks for the kidney
Locke has the operation
Cooper abandons him again and he meets Helen
Locke and Helen spend a few months together
Cooper's funeral (post-1991)
Locke works at the home inspection service and meets Nadia; Cooper returns
Locke gets the money, meets the bad guys, and hands over the money
Helen leaves him
Locke is paralyzed (2000?)
Locke works at the box factory under Randy after Hurley wins the lottery (2003?)
Locke talks to a phone-sex operator named Helen
Locke goes to Australia for a walkabout (2004?)

--Pedxing 12:30, 26 April 2006 (PDT)

Would any of these dates contradict the theory that the balcony collapse caused Locke's paralysis, thus eliminating it? --manicpaniccomix

Jumping to conclusions

In the sixth and seventh season of MacGyver, Angus Macgyver drives a pickup truck manufactured in the 1940s, the show is set in the 1990s. Just because a car or any other item is manufactured or sold a certain year, that alone isn't a basis for many valid timeline facts. The only thing it tells us that if someone is using the said item, it happens after it's being manufactured/sold, how long after can just as well be 1 week or 1 decade. --skks 12:32, 26 April 2006 (PDT)

Indeed. So since Sawyer and Gordy both are seen with 1999 or newer vehicles, we can place those events after 1999, correct? Since the crash is said to have happened in 2004, I think saying "in the five years before the crash" is a valid statement. --Pedxing 12:34, 26 April 2006 (PDT)

I'm not a fan of stating the obvious, but if you feel like the obvious needs to be said - you can edit it in. There has been some questions about the year of the crash also. --skks 12:38, 26 April 2006 (PDT)

Conclusions vs. facts

I think we ought to decide on a standard for determining the strength of a date (or any other fact here). For example, we could use something like the following to prioritize the soundness of a fact, in order of soundness:

An event that is shown on screen during the show
Artifacts created for the show and shown on screen (the lottery ticket, medicine bottle, maps, etc)
Events discussed during the show but not shown
Conclusions drawn directly from the above
Official discussions, web sites, or publications
Circumstantial evidence (cars, props, etc)
Conclusions drawn from any of the above

In other words, deciding that Hurley won the lottery after 2002 because of the car he bought would be firm, but not really solid - the producers could have just messed up with the prop. --Pedxing 13:00, 26 April 2006 (PDT)

1944

D-Day is supposed to be June 6th, 1944. Is this a Lost inconsistancy or wiki user error? --Thesmallman

1987

Hugh McIntyre states that the Hanso Foundation funding of the Dharma Initative was cut off / cancled, not that the project was cancled / closed down, it may have continued in a limited manner from other funding sources Joesoap

1998

The Oceanic web page shows Sepember 22 as being Tuesday. That would make the year 1998. http://www.oceanic-air.com/

Or 2009... I think we need to change this up into relative dates and absolute dates. Relative means things like the few days Anna Lucia and Jack's dad were together in Australia before the crash, while absolutes mean things like the dates on items and such. I'm sure the timeline won't weave together exactly, but it'll be close. --Pedxing 14:03, 8 May 2006 (PDT)

The date of the crash was 22 September 2004, we found that out in the last episode when Locke told Desmond. So there are some defininte inconsistencies with the dates. Stuartgr 12:40, 30 May 2006 (PDT)

Jack's luggage tag shows 21st as the date of the flight, the international date line is involved, does Monday the 22nd or Tues the 21st give 2004 as being a possible year ? Joesoap

orientation films produced in 1980

I don't think it can be said for sure that the orientation movies were produced in 1980 just because their copyright dates are 1980. --Ernest 11:24, 12 May 2006 (PDT)

815 Take-off

What is the source for "Oceanic Airlines flight 815 took off 22 September 2004 at 2:55pm..."? Presumably this is wrong if you consider the fact that the blastdoor map has a entry with a date of 1/6/05. Assume this is U.S. Date format so it references January, 6th, 2005. If the plane took off September 22nd 2004, and the first season = 40 days and the second season was roughly 17-20 days by the time the blastdoor map was seen... that means the date on the blastdoor is in the future. The blast door could be wrong, but since the writers/producers have been coy about when the plane took off and when the show actually takes place... September 22nd 2004 is probably an incorrect date/year. :From a writer standpoint they are probably setting this show well in the future (2009 as mentioned by Pedxing is probably close to the mark). This frees them up to do flashbacks that date reference timeframes current to the episode airtimes without running into continuity problems. If they set this in 2004, eventually all flashbacks would have to be "period pieces". This way they can do more current flashbacks and keep the crashdate as a moving target in the future.--Isotope23 12:20, 12 May 2006 (PDT)

It might not be 1/6/06 at all :-) (see Hidden Map Timeline) --Jambalaya 12:31, 12 May 2006 (PDT)

still looks like a 5 to me... regardless, I'm still curious as to the source of the the "22 September 2004 at 2:55pm" statement since the writers/producers have been extremely non-commital about when the crash actually happened.--Isotope23 18:53, 12 May 2006 (PDT)

I think it's 03 not 05; look at the 3 in 23 just above it, nearly identical. That also fits the timeline correctly. -- LOSTonthis darnisland 20:27, 19 May 2006 (PDT)

I'm going to agree on the '03 since it is now confirmed by Live Together, Die Alone that the flight did indeed take off 22nd September 2004. Guy has as bad of handwriting as I do.--Isotope23 05:00, 25 May 2006 (PDT)

The date is definitely 03 according to many sites I've read, despite it looking like 05 apparently if you compare it to the way other 3's and 5's are written on the door you can see it's a 3. That's what I read anyway... Also the date of the crash was confirmed as 22nd September 2004 as Locke told Desmond this was the date and it appeared in the logs. Stuartgr 12:46, 30 May 2006 (PDT)

The computer in The Pearl

Does anyone recognize the model? Is it another Apple II? --Jambalaya 12:42, 12 May 2006 (PDT)

Sayid, Nadia, Locke

Sayid faciliates the escape of Nadia, who has her house inspected by a mobile Locke. Sayid tortures Tariq, and (source: One of Them) states that he continued torturing for the next 6 years (age 23-29). Sayid was in Sydney to infiltrate terrorist cell for CIA-sting to get Nadia-information; how long had he been actively looking for her before that point? Why was he on tele (source:What Kate did) while Kate was in Sam's office (after killing Wayne, then was on the run for several years)? How long was Locke in the wheelchair prior to the crash? Four years? LOSTonthisdarnisland 11:18, 16 May 2006 (PDT)

You should add those to Unanswered Questions! --Ernest 11:34, 16 May 2006 (PDT)

I was actually looking for feedback to determine a tighter timeline, if possible. 01:38, 17 May 2006 (PDT)

September 22

So they take off at 14:55 in Sydney. Sydney is GMT+10, so takeoff is at 04:55 GMT. The plane encounters turbulence six hours later at about 11:00 GMT. They turn back to the South (so they will be East of Fiji per Desmond's sailing directions) and two hours later are roughly 900 miles off course, 1500 miles from Fiji, near Bora Bora and the plane crashes at about 13:00 GMT. This is about 03:00 local time since Bora Bora is GMT-10, but they are past the international dateline, so is the morning of September 22. Sunrise in Bora Bora on September 22, 2004, was at 05:56. But the sun was shining when the plane crashed! Oops, continuity error... :) --Pedxing 12:19, 31 May 2006 (PDT)

Another possibility was raised at Talk:Log printout. If the timestamp in the log printout is correct and the flight crashed at 4:16 PM local time, everything changes. This would mean that the flight was somehow redirected to the West rather than the East, placing the island near East Africa! The time would correlate well to the daylight (and daytime remaining) after the crash and would explain how the Nigerian drig smugglers plane got there! Could we have a major plot breakthrough or is this simply a continuity error? --Pedxing 07:10, 1 June 2006 (PDT)

This possibility is also supported by the Electromagnetic malfunction thingum from The Swan; If the overload started a significant amount of time before the plane crashed, it could explain why their insturments failed, and would also offer an explanation as to why they were going entirely the wrong direction: Their compass was off.--NotARedHerring 14:01, 26 September 2006 (PDT)

See below, #Location of the Island: which Ocean?. --Kuzak 10:07, 25 May 2007 (PDT)

Jack and Sarah -- Shannon (also Desmond!)

OK. Shannon is 20 in the series. She is 18 when her father dies. Jack meets Sarah at the same time. That would put that somewhere around 2002. Jack and Sarah knew each other for two years before being married. That would put it in about 2004 when they were married, not giving them very much time to get a divorce. Also -- it was the same time in 2002 when Desmond was training for his race around the world. He was in the hatch for two years. That would be consistent with my timeline. Any thoughts? Should the info be changed (the timeline lists Jack's as being a year earlier)? -Platypus Man | Talk 18:33, 28 September 2006 (PDT)

In Flashes Before Your Eyes, the old woman (Ms. Hawking) says that Desmond will be in the Hatch for 3 years. Of course, I don't understand the whole bizarre "Lost Time" thing so it might not be an inconsistency. But if he was in the Hatch for three years, he would have gotten there in fall of 2001.

Not sure if this is really an inconsistency. I think all the events you're describing happened in late 2001. If Shannon's birthday was for example, Nov 28, she would have turned 20 years old on Nov 28, 2003. That would still mean she was 20 during her time on the island. Also meaning that she is just about to turn 21 before she is killed. That would also mean that she would be 18 for the last month of 2001, ie. December 2001. The car accident, Jack meeting Sarah, Jack meeting Desmond, Adam Rutherford's funeral could have all happened in Dec 2001. That would give Jack and Sarah two years to court and get married in 2003. Also, Desmond could leave on his trip in 2002 and crash on the island, giving him two years to spend there before flight 815 arrives. I realise my suggestion doesn't fly with what Ms. Hawking said but I think it fits all the other data. Nov 28 was just a suggestion. Any day after September would work really.--Bigfunkymonkey 00:19, 14 April 2007 (PDT)

Cleanup or Rewrite

This article is very poorly written and inconsistant. I suggest it be cleaned up or rewritten. Possibly separate TLE dates and the tv show dates.--Dicola 22:35, 17 December 2006 (PST)

1896 - Death of Magnus Hanso

2004 minus 108 is 1896. Alvar Hanso is reportedly born by then. Black Rock arrived before that. Makes sense that what got the ball rolling was the death of Magnus. That's the big event that set everything else into motion. Of course no proof of this in the canon, which is why I didn't put this in the timeline. -- ZachsMind 12:44, 2 April 2007 (PDT)

Kate, Cassidy, and Sawyer's timeline

I added some 2001/2002 stuff for Kate, Cassidy, and Sawyer. Since they're all linked, and we have a few long events (a pregnancy and a jail sentence), these events can be placed reasonably well.

Since Kate killed Wayne and ran from the law in 2001, the events of "Left Behind", meeting a not-too-pregnant Cassidy in Iowa, must have happened shortly after that, possibly in late 2001 or early 2002. Cassidy would have turned Sawyer in to the authorities around this time on Kate's advice.
Working backwards, we can assume that Sawyer's con of Cassidy in "The Long Con" ended around the end of 2001 or beginning of 2002.
Clementine would have been born later in 2002, with Cassidy visiting Sawyer in prison, and the events of "Every Man for Himself" happening in late 2002 or 2003, with Sawyer released from prison after serving about one year of his 7 year sentence.
The Tampa job would have happened around 2003 - it couldn't be much later since there has to be time for him to lose Hibbs, get tracked down, and the events of "Outlaws".
Sometime in 2004, Sawyer headed to Australia.

Thoughts? --Pedxing 09:13, 6 April 2007 (PDT)

In "One of Us" Juliet says Sawyer shot and killed someone "the night before (he) got on the plane". Wouldn't that make the murder on the 21st? Tebor 17:16, 14 April 2007 (PDT)

Christian Shephard

If Sawyer killed Duckett on the 21st, wouldn't he have met Christian earlier that day. The same day he and Ana Lucia parted ways? Tebor 13:17, 15 April 2007 (PDT)

Claim that Ben was born in 1963

There is no canon source for Ben being born in 1963. The 1963 date is a theory from an anonymous person associated with the production. Beyond not being canon, its possible for up to 1963 cars to indicate a 1962 or 1963 date since its december. Dharmatel4 01:54, 12 May 2007 (PDT)

Cars made in 1963 or before do not indicate or confirm the year being 1963, it can only suggest it and therefore should not be included. Personally, not enough cars were shown to get a good enough percentage. The Kombi can't justify this date. MightyHealthy 00:30, 15 May 2007 (PDT)

Graphical Representation

I think that some sort of graphical representation could be a good feature to add, probably as an off-shoot article or a just as an added picture. I'd like to have a crack at this; I'm studying graphic/communication design and a graph/timeline of this magnitude would be crazy. I'm not talking about a simplistic timeline bar with arrows and text, I mean a statistical graph as well as an event timeline that would depict location. I might be rambling at this point, so I'll come back once I have a clearer idea of the information and a stylish means in which to depict it. »MightyHealthy 22:57, 14 May 2007 (PDT)

Rousseau's Story

I've been trying to get Rousseau's story to mesh with the numbers broadcast and such, and something just doesn't sit right. Is there any information about the numbers broadcast that contradicts her arrival in 1988? For example, was there anything in the episode "Numbers" that specifically stated when Sam Toomey and Leonard Simms were stationed in the Pacific, or was the date given for that (1988) just based on Rousseau's story (a bit circular)? It just looks to me like a lot of what's here is based on what she's said, and I'd say that her character is more than a little unstable and that she's been out of touch for a long time - probably doesn't have any idea what the current year is. Then again, time might not be relevant at all on the island. --Doc 13:24, 21 May 2007 (PDT)

Location of the Island: which Ocean?

I am going to delete the "note" in the timeline saying that Oceanic Flight 815 may have been flying west rather than east, in which case the Island is in the Indian Ocean (near East Africa).[2] In Live Together, Die Alone (Part 1 and 2) transcript, Desmond says that when he left the Island, he travelled due west at 9 knots, and he expected to be in Fiji in less than a week. Thus Desmond believes the Island to be in the Pacific Ocean (not the Indian). Desmond originally shipwrecked on the Island during a storm, and he certainly would know which ocean he had been in at that time (see Elizabeth (sailboat)). Also, in "Numbers", it is specifically stated that the numbers had been broadcast from the South Pacific. --Kuzak 10:05, 25 May 2007 (PDT)

See also The Island/Theories#Location and Flight path of Oceanic 815.--Kuzak 10:18, 25 May 2007 (PDT)

See also the article Twenty dollar bill, showing that Henry Gale arrived on the Island while crossing the Pacific in a balloon. --Kuzak 22:34, 25 May 2007 (PDT)

Locke's commune flashback - 1996?

Why is Locke's flashback to his commune dated as occuring in 1996? In 'Further Instructions', Jan states that Eddie the cop was recruited "fresh out of the academy", and the close up picture of Eddie's records ([3]) indicates he's been a cop, "1994-PRESENT". So wouldn't that mean that Locke's flashback occured in 1994, not 1996?

Danielle,Kelvin,Mikhail's arrival vs. The Purge

I think these three arrivals pinpoint the purge. To make this work, we have to assume that Danielle isn't telling the real truth why she is on the island, or the events surrounding her loss of Alex. I believe that Danielle and her team came to the island as new recruits for Dharma. Danielle gave birth to her daughter, but she was taken away by Dharma for tests. Danielle losses it and is exielled from the group. She fights back and kills some of her captors. She tries to alert Dharma to the issue and leaves a cryptic message at the Radio Tower. Now, Dharma is still in control on the island, and I can't explain why they leave the signal alone. Kelvin comes to the island to man the Swan in 1992. The Purge occurs on December 21st, 1993. The submarine is currently bringing the next group of recruits, including Mikhail. They arrive on the island to the Hostiles in control, Mikhail joins up with them. They take on additional personnel and/or knowledge of how to arrive/leave the island and contact the outside world. The Dharma personnel that don't join up are shot and dumped in the mass grave( explains the bullet-hole body ). No more Dharma personnel show up, so Kelvin/Radsinsky start exploring the island. If anyone can assist in explaining the distress call, this would tie up these years leading up to the Purge. Samhain99 09:38, 18 October 2007 (PDT)

Jack's Age

How did you know that Jack was born in 1967? Had the fact was told in the episodes? Am I the only one who missed it? I'm really really curious about it. Please anyone help me. Thanks in advance. --Foxysmile 00:42, 22 October 2007 (PDT)

Christian died on September 21st? Sawyer met him in a bar that day?

Wait. This doesn't make sense:

Sawyer bumps into Ana Lucia and Christian outside the cocktail bar. Christian and Ana Lucia part ways. ("Two for the Road")
Sawyer meets Christian inside the cocktail bar. Christian talks Sawyer into finishing his business. ("Outlaws")
Christian dies of a heart attack. (offscreen during "White Rabbit" flashbacks)
Sawyer kills Frank Duckett. ("Outlaws")
Sawyer is arrested following a bar fight. ("Hearts and Minds")
September 22nd, 2004: After spending three days in a police cell, Sawyer is deported to the USA. ("Exodus, Part 1")

So this would suggest that Sawyer's killing of Duckett occurred on September 19 or earlier, as Sawyer surely didn't shoot Duckett while he was in a police cell. And I doubt the Australian police let a man they were going to deport walk around Sydney freely, giving him the chance to commit a murder.

Of course, the problem here is "One of Us", where Juliet claims that Sawyer killed a man the night before he boarded the plane...--Nevermore 02:02, 30 January 2008 (PST)

Oh wait. There's more to this: In "Exodus, Part 1", Sawyer estimates his meeting with Christian as "about a week before we all got on the plane".--Nevermore 02:11, 30 January 2008 (PST)

Yemi's plane, Eko's childhood

Just read the pre-crash timeline and I noticed the following is missing. I don't know which episodes they occured in though sorry, maybe someone who has the episodes can work out what dates the events happened?

Eko as a child shoots someone to prevent his brother from being forced to kill. I think they mentioned how old he was at the time so we can work out the year based on the year he was born (already determined).
Yemi is shot and taken away in Eko's drug smuggling plane and crashes on the Island, and Eko starts becoming a real priest

--Malthor 07:59, 6 March 2008 (PST)

Desmond's timeline & Sarah McLachlan's "Building a Mystery"

Hi everyone; I'm new here, so I'm not sure if I'm posting this properly or in the right place -- anyway, I was recently watching Season 3's "Flashes Before Your Eyes," and noticed Sarah McLachlan's "Building a Mystery" playing in the background. As the page for it here on Lostpedia says, it's from the "Surfacing" album, released in 1997. Now, the flashback scenes in "Flashes Before Your Eyes" have Penny and Desmond together, so they take place BEFORE the events in "The Constant" where Desmond has broken up with Penny and is in the military. And yet we're told in "The Constant" that Desmond is in the military in 1996 -- so how could "Building a Mystery" from 1997 have been playing on the radio (or CD player or whatever) in the earlier scenes from "Flashes Before Your Eyes"?

Ironically, we seem to be "Building a Mystery" here. ;) I suppose this was just an oversight on the writers' part? If so, they should do a better job of planning out things like this ahead of time. I wonder if they ever check Lostpedia to help them keep track of things? ;)

Brendan815 22:37, 13 March 2008 (PDT)

dates based on ages

I notice there are some dates given based on character's ages (i.e. Locke at ages 5 and 16). Obviously anyone who is not born on January 1st will experience parts of two different calendar years at any give age. So Richard's test for example could happen anytime between May 30th 1961 and May 29th 1962. I changed parts of the timeline to reflect this. --Jackdavinci 06:21, 11 May 2008 (PDT)

This makes sense for the "age 5" entry, but Locke is clearly in the Spring term of school in the "Age 16" flashback because they're discussing plans for the summer. Locke turned 16 May 30, 1972, which makes the Spring term of 1973.--Marksman 06:51, 13 May 2008 (PDT)

Good catch! Though I wonder if back then people made their summer plans so far in advance as we do nowadays. Just throwing around the conceivability of a post-May-30th-1972 decision regarding summer plans. Can you give some other indicators of time of year from that scene? I don't have the time at the moment to go back through the ep. I will later today if I get a chance.--Overworkedirish 07:08, 13 May 2008 (PDT)

- They could be discussing summer plans on June 1, 1972 or May 1, 1973 and he would still be 16 and in the Spring term. --Jackdavinci 08:02, 13 May 2008 (PDT)

Doubtful. In the early 1970's, school years end before Memorial Day, which was May 26 in 1972. Tustin High School still ends its school year before Memorial Day, according to its website.--Marksman 10:07, 13 May 2008 (PDT)

Style Consistency

Why are some entries in the timeline listed with the date and then "-th," "-nd," "-st", etc. ("March 2nd," for example, rather than "March 2") and some are without? One way or the other, it doesn't matter to me, but we should decide on a style and be consistent throughout.--sockmonkey 11:37, 11 May 2008 (PDT)

The suffixes are superfluous--let's nix 'em. $0.02 Robert K S (talk) 19:52, 11 May 2008 (PDT)

Personally, I like them, and I'll say that the "Post-crash Timeline" uses them very consistently (admittedly I did some massive clean-up on that article myself...). We should stay consistent throughout all timeline pages.--Overworkedirish 06:28, 13 May 2008 (PDT)

After some thought. I agree. Edited "Timeline:Post-Island" to fit this style. Also reformatted first bit of this article to match format on "Timeline:Post-Island" which has worked very well for organization.--Overworkedirish 09:23, 13 May 2008 (PDT)

Purge vs. Alex Abduction

I was just skimming the message board on ABC where people post questions for the podcast and came across an intriguing one. In "Cabin Fever" Horace says he's been dead for 12 years. Hence Purge date being December 19th, 1992. But Alex is 16 in 2004, born in 1988, supposedly abducted at birth by Ben / the Others. BUT THE OTHERS WERE THE HOSTILES THEN. So why doesn't Danielle know about DHARMA??? How did she and Alex survive the Purge??? And furthermore, how could Danielle put her recording in the DHARMA radio tower if DHARMA WAS STILL OPERATING??? I don't think the writers would overlook this date/timing - especially because they've been explicitly saying lately that we're going to see Danielle's backstory soon. Personally, I think that what we THINK we know about Danielle's history may go out the window come the beginning of Season 5...--Overworkedirish 06:25, 13 May 2008 (PDT)
- One possibility is that Ben had made contact with and allied with the Others before 1988 and was acting as a double agent, during which time he abducted and adopted Alex, who stayed with the Hostiles. We don't know a lot of what the Hostiles were like pre-Ben, but Ben has hinted that they were even more ruthless than he. So here's my theory: In 1988, Rousseau and team crash on the island. Rousseau's team dies of time-dilation sickness, but the unborn Alex is Rousseau's constant, so she lives. The Hostiles decide that Danielle and Alex must die. Ben makes it appear that he killed Rousseau (but he doesn't) and then takes Alex as his own, telling the Hostiles some lie so they agree not to commit infanticide. Four years later, the Purge happens. How does Rousseau survive the poison gas? Good question. I wonder if the gas was concentrated only in the barracks, which is why Ben had to kill his own father when they took their trip in the van.--Marksman 06:46, 13 May 2008 (PDT)

But then what about Rousseau's radio message? That radio tower was DHARMA operated, and Rousseau put the message in there 16 years ago. Not 12. Confusion in my brain.--Overworkedirish 07:03, 13 May 2008 (PDT)

Good question. Maybe Dharma had abandoned the radio tower in 1988 to the Hostiles and Dharma blocked the signal using the Looking Glass. This is an oddity, though.--Marksman 08:00, 13 May 2008 (PDT)

There is other evidence that the Purge occured after Danielle's arrival. Danielle's original discussion with Sayid about the distress signal indicates that possession of the transmitting location had changed hands since she altered the message. From the transcript of season 1 episode "Solitary" (emphasis added):--Eyeful Tower 09:36, 15 May 2008 (PDT)

SAYID: What is this place? Those batteries -- they wouldn't be able to produce enough power to transmit your distress call all these years.

DANIELLE: I broadcast from somewhere else. But they control it now.

SAYID: They?

DANIELLE: You. And the others like you.

I like that theory about Alex being Danielle's constant. But then again, if her time-transported conciousness only brought her to a time when Alex was "in utero," Danielle's boy-toy/husband Robert could also be her constant (he'd be around too).--Overworkedirish 07:03, 13 May 2008 (PDT)

That's true. So either Robert or Alex could be her constant. And is Robert was sent to a time before he met Danielle, he wouldn't have a constant and would go nuts, which is why Danielle had to kill her own constant!--Marksman 08:00, 13 May 2008 (PDT)

"Explanations" within Article

I have a bit of a bone to pick with this article. After many of the entries there are parenthetical "explanations" as to why a date fits in a certain place. It is not the objective of this article to provide reasoning for specific chronicling, it is meant to provide a clear-cut chain-of-events. If there is controversy over reasoning behind a certain date, it should be brought here, to the discussion page, otherwise I feel that "explanation" information should be relegated to the subject's specific page. I'll wait to hear from others before doing any drastic edits.--Overworkedirish 06:38, 13 May 2008 (PDT)
- I apologize to the extent that those parentheticals were made by me. I'm a bit new to the wiki-style editing and only just figured out these talk pages. It won't happen again. (Well, not by me, anyway.)--Marksman 06:47, 13 May 2008 (PDT)

No sweat - I wasn't getting on anybody's back or anything, just want to get it out there so we can have Lostpedia looking its best. ;-) --Overworkedirish 07:04, 13 May 2008 (PDT)

Rename

Rename to "Timeline:Pre-Crash" following this article's title in the Timeline Nav-Bar, and the format used for "Timeline:Post-Island." I'll note that when you type in "timeline:post-island" in the Lostpedia search textbox, it automatically reads it for capitalization and is the same as "Timeline:Post-Island." This rename is really for aestetic value of the article and coordination between articles.--Overworkedirish 18:36, 15 May 2008 (PDT)

Rename. To "Timeline:Pre-Crash"--Overworkedirish 18:36, 15 May 2008 (PDT)
Rename because of reasons stated already. BETTYFIZZW (Talk) 18:36, 16 May 2008 (PDT)
Renamebecause of reasons stated already. --DJVok 05:01, 18 May 2008 (PDT)