Talk:Portal:Themes

The previous contents of this page have been moved here

Reworking

as you can see i have reworked this article, i am sorry if this upsets anyone, but i will explain and then maybe you would agree. Basically i thought that an article such as "Animals" was simply a list of animals as a theme, or motif, not an actual article per se. So i have moved all the pages to, for example: "List_of_Recurring_Themes:HERE", this frees up pages for more open articles as opposed to lists etc.

i have also:

• alphabetised the list
• moved some of the longer lists to their own categories
• tidied these longer lists up as much as possible
• added comment to keep alphabetisation

i am sorry if i have moved any ongoing discussions, please feel free to move them back

- Mikey - "so emo, it hurts"©

I ended up moving them back, because honestly, the longer titles are cumbersome and anti-productive; people would not think to remember the full link "List of recurring themes:" when they do a wiki link. Also, when new theme pages are made up, often duplicates are made up because people are not aware of this format, and don't know to search for it. Usually the rule in wikis is the simpler, the better. We do all really appreciate the rest of the alphabetization/tidying/reorganization, though. --PandoraX 05:31, 24 October 2006 (PDT)

Psychology

I Have a question. Why is there nothing written about the psychology theme? It seems to be pretty apparent and important. Also there should probably even be a subtheme of social psychology too. It is literally everywhere on the show. For instance, the social psychology stuff is obvious in the max candle tapes and his mention that the island is a social psychology experiment. It is also in the less obvious instances. The others are seen as an out group and fit perfectly into that schema. Not to mention the group dynamics within the groups in lost. The fact that jack fits in as a leader much in the way defined by social psychology. The torture by Sayid is all social psych. Sawyer as a con man employs alot of social psych. Furthermore the grander scheme of psychology in general seems important to ask, such as the allusion to multiple experiments. The obedience experiment of Milgram parrallels somewhat to the pushing of the button. The polar bear experiment. The memory game that was a clue on THF. The suggestion that DHARMA is an anagram for Department of Heuristics. To be honest the main reason I enjoy this show so much is because there is so much psychology in it and I am a psych major!

Well, I'm a psychiatrist myself, so I agree this is an overarching theme, but all you had to do was do a search and see we had that page, and link it. I'll add that now, so far it's been grouped with the other sciences, but I'll add a theme category. I think the thing with psych is 1) we do not know the Others' exact plans, and there's a lot of speculating how this theme really fits in, and 2) it's a very broad theme that covers many of the other themes, such as isolation/confinement/fear/economics, and so forth. --PandoraX 11:04, 28 October 2006 (PDT)

Locke's Scar

Just thought it was worth mentioning that Locke's scar is visible in his flashbacks (i.e before the crash) although I only noticed in the episode where he meets Rose in the airport. It may be that it is a real scar of the actor, though. --LostCat 04:54, 2 June 2006 (PDT)

Red

1. In the beginning of "Three Minutes" the Hatch floor is covered in the blood of the murdered Ana Lucia and Libby
2. John Locke's shirt is almost completely red with blood after he carries Boone back from the fallen Beechcraft.

These are rediculous. Seeing red because there is blood present is not a recurring theme. --Keyes 01:34, 17 June 2006 (PDT)

If you were referring to every time someone say cut a finger I would agree but these are both instances where there's large amount of the substances. Furthermore there's an inherent psychological link between the color red and the substance blood. the first often brings the latter to mind.--Tricksterson 09:03, 17 June 2006 (PDT)

But they're such trivial things. Blood was on the floor of the hatch because someone had been shot with a gun. It's not a recurring theme. If there wasn't blood on the floor something would be very wrong with the universe. --Keyes 15:20, 17 June 2006 (PDT)

I completely agree. I've been itching to remove it, but I think more people should decide than just two.--Miss Mary Mack 09:45, 22 June 2006 (PDT)

Well, I'll happily make it three. "Blood is red" doesn't really count as a theme. --Wintermute 09:44, 20 July 2006 (PDT)

The colour Red is just not prominant enough to be considered a theme (like say Black and White). Also, I would consider Scotland to be about as much a theme as Australia or the United States or any other nation that features regularly in Lost. Cull them both I say. --Kivipat

Scotland?

this is a bit tenuous imo. might as well include australia and america if we're gonna include scotland. i'm gonna delete it. --kaini. 21:30, 30 July 2006 (PDT)

Cleanup

Lots of these subheadings honestly can not be viewed as recurring themes. I can understand Black and White for example, but certainly not Cancer, or Hoarding. --Phmall 21:50, 30 July 2006 (PDT)

tried to condense some of these; i can actually agree with fear upon rewriting, but it might need a new heading (although WTH it should be, i have no idea)... others, like cancer, probable deserve a disambig page at best imo. --kaini. 21:59, 30 July 2006 (PDT)

I wonder why fear is even there; a bunch a people crash land on a mysterious island with a cloud of black smoke that kills people and have encounters with a group of strange people, there's bound to be some fear in there. Whatever the case may be, I think the subheadings that are left (after we deleted like 3) are fine now that you've cleaned them up.. except for the brothers section; that's just silly. --Phmall 22:31, 30 July 2006 (PDT)

Agreed, I think we could do away with "fear" and "pearls", random stuff like that. I've already cleared out some; "Leg Injuries" (silly, and covered in amputations page already). I think some are just under the impression that more is always better, which I don't agree with necessarily. Also... are kissing and sex really themes to the show? Or just "stuff that happens on the show, that I can list". --PandoraX 05:31, 24 October 2006 (PDT)

Kantian Philosophy

It is interesting that the philosopher Locke is an Enlightenment Empericist, while the character Locke describes himself more as a "man of faith". His relationship to Jack seems to illustrate the importance of a balance between faith and reason. --Immanuel k 22:21, 4 August 2006 (PDT)

Just curious - is anyone aware of any theories or speculation regardian Kant's critical philosophy as a framework for the Lost themes? I haven't thought it through yet, but initially, it does seem that the Critique of Pure Reason, with its reaction against the rigid Empiricism of Hume, carries similar themes to Season 1. Season 2 takes a noticable philosophical turn (especially with regard to Locke's faith), and seems to perhaps fit the thesis of Kant's second critique, of Practical Reason. I'm wondering if this can be born out, and perhaps foreshadow a thematic foundation for Season 3, mirroring the Critique of Judgment? Speculative, I know, but there are definite philosophical/epistemological undercurrents being allegorized here.--Immanuel k 23:07, 4 August 2006 (PDT)

family

i know there is already a section for relationships, however, familes (broken, dysfunctional, etc) seem to be a very common occurance and theme within the show. as a matter of fact it seems more and more apparent that the main characters have no intimate ties leading them back to the non-island world. yes an exception of this is desmond, but since that tie was the travelling point for the first 'real'-time scene off the island, it is obviously a deliberate exception worthy of note and most likely incurring consequences. what do people think?--Two Coyotes 23:02, 17 September 2006 (PDT)

The Pilot missing arm?

Do you mean his dead body up in the tree? --Minderbinder 07:19, 4 October 2006 (PDT)

Geronimo Jackson ?

How is this a theme? You might as well post Sawyer or The Swan. Now if someone wants to put Music, or Musical Groups, that I could see.--Tricksterson 07:19, 27 October 2006 (PDT)

Rename: Recurring themes vs. motifs

Technically, a motif is a recurring element of a literary exposition that occurs in the narrative universe. A theme is a prevalent allegory within the subtext and generally intended as commentary by the author. LOST certainly has themes, but that is another level of literary analysis below the mere reoccurance of plot elements. --Scottkj 11:47, 3 December 2006 (PST)

No Sorry Scott... while I agree with you on a technical/literary level, most users in common speech will use the two terms interchangeably. I think if we split hairs too much, it introduces unnecessary confusion. --PandoraX 07:06, 10 December 2006 (PST)

Disagree: It's fine as it is. --Marik7772003 12:57, 12 December 2006 (PST)

Shamefully Disagree: You're absolutely correct, but most American college graduates are unfamiliar with the word motif, I'm somewhat ashamed to admit. It's probably best to name articles in a way that they can be found. -BearDog 13:19, 12 December 2006 (PST)

Do not rename, for all above reasons-- 16:39, 12 December 2006 (PST)

CONSENSUS: No change. --Scottkj 21:58, 12 December 2006 (PST)

• Just FYI, I've redirected Motifs and Motif here. --PandoraX 05:04, 25 December 2006 (PST)

Merge with Portal:Themes

The Portal:Themes page is very out of date. Can we just have it redirect to Themes ?--Dagg 13:13, 26 December 2006 (PST)

• Merge: --   Dee4leeds  talk  contribs  all  07:07, 27 December 2006 (PST)
• Merge, BUT redirect instead to Category:Recurring Themes instead. The Portal:Themes page is nice looking, but as stated, very out of date, and not user friendly to update (has to have picture thumbnails of each). It also has only more general themes, whereas the cat can be kept updated regularly with more specific themes. --PandoraX 13:23, 27 December 2006 (PST)

Link Broken

The Cons & Deception picture and text led to the incorrect article. They lead to children, instead of Deceptions and cons. Can someone fix this (it's been locked from editing) Thanks. David 16:22, 8 January 2007 (PST)

Salvation also leads to pregnancies. Thanks David 16:24, 8 January 2007 (PST)

Last time I swear (I've checked all them now). Eyes links to electromagnetism. Thanks again David 16:26, 8 January 2007 (PST)

It's still not fixed!!! SysOp? David 18:18, 8 January 2007 (PST)

• Fixed. -- ^Contrib¯ _Santa_ ¯  ^Talk  20:14, 15 January 2007 (PST)
  • There are still a few that David listed that are broken. Can someone take a look?--Dagg 20:23, 15 January 2007 (PST)
• THe Salvation and cons and deception links are the problems. --Marik7772003 20:25, 15 January 2007 (PST)

note to self

Trope Wiki also has a list of recurring themes-- themes that recur between shows, and have been represented in Lost (rather than themes that recur repeatedly within Lost). Not sure where to put this external link yet. -- ^Contrib¯ _Santa_ ¯  ^Talk  20:13, 15 January 2007 (PST)